The WELL: inkwell.vue.306: Joshua Piven, "The Escape Artists"

#73: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 6 Sep 07 17:55

Thu, 06 Sep 2007 17:55:00 PDT

#72: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Thu 6 Sep 07 17:54

Thu, 06 Sep 2007 17:54:00 PDT

Josh, my point is that the term "escape artist," as used by you, is a clever image to expand how we look at the "Hoodini-esque" way this term is used by most people. However, when you link this metaphor to the term "escapism" you conjure up a negative connotation in terms of how that term is commonly applied--namely, people who are unable to cope with "normal" life and thereby use drugs, adrenalin sports, books, religious or psychological denial, etc. to "escape." My point is that by using the word "escapism," your apt metaphor for individuals choosing "alternative", personally fulfulling, out-of-the-ordinary life work begins to fall apart.

In any event, thank you for participating in Inkwell, and good luck with your writing. [Read entire topic]

#71: Josh Piven (jpiven) Thu 6 Sep 07 16:55

Thu, 06 Sep 2007 16:55:00 PDT

Thanks all, esp. Steve and Cynthia who made it happen!

Re: Scott's comments:

<<When you refer to the life work of your subjects as "escapism", there is a negative value judgment to the chosen path.>>

Scott, again I'm not sure what you mean. Who's making a negative value judgment? I'm certainly not. I coined the term as it applies to career choices because it suggests that people are choosing to follow something they are passionate about and thus figuratively "escape" from a life more ordinary, to do something they feel is extraordinary, or purposeful, or both. They are "escaping" to a more fulfilling destination. Many of the subjects described working in an office as equivalent to being in a type of prison. I don't suggest that this is the case for most, or even many people. Bu it is the case for some. You need not get hung up on the term, however. It's just a descriptive phrase, a term of art, nothing more.

<<it is too simplistic to suggest that people are "escapist" who find innovative, spiritually transcendent, or exciting work that does not fit the "norm". >>

Why? What's wrong with suggesting this? Replace "escapist" with "fulfilled" and I don't see the problem.

<<Who is to say when "escape" is a healthier or unhealthier engagement with life? >>

The people who experience it, that's who. They make the determination. And that's the point. They are engaged on a level that is atypical of the workaday world, and they like it that way. I'm not sure I understand your argument with that. Or perhaps I am misreading what you wrote.

Gotta run, hope to be back to continue this conversation . . . [Read entire topic]

#70: Autumn (autumn) Wed 5 Sep 07 14:02

Wed, 05 Sep 2007 14:02:00 PDT

Yes, thank you. [Read entire topic]

#69: Steve Bjerklie (stevebj) Wed 5 Sep 07 13:58

Wed, 05 Sep 2007 13:58:00 PDT

Josh, thank you for an informative, fascinating interview. [Read entire topic]

#68: Cynthia Dyer-Bennet (cdb) Wed 5 Sep 07 09:07

Wed, 05 Sep 2007 09:07:00 PDT

(Scott slipped in while I was composing my post!)

I hope you'll at least have the time to comment on what Scott posted, Josh. [Read entire topic]

#67: Cynthia Dyer-Bennet (cdb) Wed 5 Sep 07 09:06

Wed, 05 Sep 2007 09:06:00 PDT

Thanks for the details, Josh. "...they knew whom they were marrying at the outset" makes sense. It's good to be matched with a partner who shares one's level of risk tolerance.

Thanks, also, for joining us for these past two weeks, Steve and Josh. This has been quite an interesting conversation! I really admire people who are willing to pursue their dreams. It must have been such an interesting writing project to research.

Though our virtual spotlight has turned to a new interview, this doesn't mean this conversation has to stop. The topic will remain open for further comments and questions indefinitely, so feel free to stick around if you can.

If other things are demanding your attention now, I wish you all the best in seeing your first novel published, Josh. Good luck! [Read entire topic]

#66: Scott MacFarlane (s-macfarlane) Wed 5 Sep 07 09:00

Wed, 05 Sep 2007 09:00:00 PDT

"to make family life work in conjunction with escapism"

Josh, I like the term "escape artist" when it refers to indivuals moving beyond living life as cogs in the system and finding work for themselves that is filled with more passion. However, I think this use of the term is where your metaphor breaks down.

When you refer to the life work of your subjects as "escapism", there is a negative value judgment to the chosen path. This is related to the idea of responsibility, and who gets to decide which paths are more responsible. Certainly, we all juggle obligations to ourselves, our partners, our immediate and extended family, our community, our governments, our earth, but it is too simplistic to suggest that people are "escapist" who find innovative, spiritually transcendent, or exciting work that does not fit the "norm". The paradox for many who risk their dreams is that such life work is closer to life play, and that such "escape" leads to greater fulfillment, and a balance in life that engenders better relationships. Who is to say when "escape" is a healthier or unhealthier engagement with life? [Read entire topic]

#65: Josh Piven (jpiven) Wed 5 Sep 07 07:02

Wed, 05 Sep 2007 07:02:00 PDT

Yes, I did encounter such spouses. Most were supportive because they knew whom they were marrying at the outset.

That said, some (especially Aileen, Jack-the-surfer's spouse) eventually had to demand some adjustments in order to make family life work in conjunction with escapism. And sometimes this meant scaling back one's passions, even just a little. This was the case with Mark Divine, who realized that being in the Navy SEALs isn't exactly conducive to married life, and family life.

In one case, of course (Rick Coyle), the escape led to a divorce, and eventual estrangement from children. [Read entire topic]

#64: Cynthia Dyer-Bennet (cdb) Tue 4 Sep 07 17:24

Tue, 04 Sep 2007 17:24:00 PDT

Josh, did do encounter many Escape Artists who had made a radical career change while they were partnered and had young children to support?

And even if there weren't children involved, how did spouses respond to partners who were throwing away secure jobs to chase rainbows that might or might not have pots of gold at the other end? [Read entire topic]