pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #26 of 411: strangely hoochie (pellmell) Mon 27 Jan 03 14:16
    
re 24:

http://www.snopes.com/photos/binoculars.htm 
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #27 of 411: John Brewer (jbrewer) Mon 27 Jan 03 14:29
    
That's what I love about The Well.  Exactly half an hour from post to
rebuttal.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #28 of 411: Hardheadipus Delirius (murffy) Mon 27 Jan 03 14:34
    
re 24

It's possible GWB, like many people (myself included) brought the
binoculars up to his eyes with the lens caps on and then realized his
mistake and took them off. But with the cameras rolling all the time,
it's a simple matter to extract the frame where Bush brings the
binoculars up and, taking the moment out of context, making him look
like a dolt. Not that he isn't a dolt but the photograph is not
evidence either way.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #29 of 411: Hardheadipus Delirius (murffy) Mon 27 Jan 03 14:37
    
Pellmell beat me to the punch.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #30 of 411: the way of truth and love has always won (jnfr) Mon 27 Jan 03 16:58
    
I noticed that only today have stories started about Iraq connections to Al 
Quaeda (a "senior member" travelled through Iraq last year, said CNN, and no 
way that could have happened without Saddam knowing). If there is proof of 
Saddam financing AQ operations, I want to see them. I don't like Saddam, I 
won't miss him once he's gone, but I feel deeply that we're pointing in the 
wrong direction here, and it's happening because it's easier than actually 
dealing with the problem, and because the Administration believes it's 
politically advantageous to do so.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #31 of 411: Ron Sipherd (ronks) Wed 29 Jan 03 09:26
    
There's an interesting commentary from TomPaine.com on today's op-ed page
that asks where the old-style principled conservatives are.  It was not so
very long ago they stood up for balanced budgets, fiscal prudence, and
limited government. That these goals should become Democratic Party themes
has a kind of Alice In Wonderland quality to it.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #32 of 411: Hal Royaltey (hal) Wed 29 Jan 03 13:37
    
As noted in Topic 1, post 5 those readers who are not Well
members are invited to participate in this discussion.   

Please mail your comments to:

  <prevue-hosts@well.com>
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #33 of 411: Hal Royaltey (hal) Fri 31 Jan 03 13:11
    
Hans Blix, the chief UN weapons inspector, is disputing
Mr. Bush's State of the Union interpretation of the team's
results and report.   The report is buried on page 10 of
the New York Times.

 <http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/31/international/middleeast/31BLIX.html>
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #34 of 411: Growlin Jack King (gjk) Fri 31 Jan 03 13:35
    

That Hans Blix guy better be careful or he could have a terrible accident.

Just a word to the wise.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #35 of 411: the way of truth and love has always won (jnfr) Fri 31 Jan 03 17:49
    
I went looking to see how much this story is getting play, by searching 
Google News. I didn't find much in U.S. papers, though German, Pakistani, 
and Australian papers were covering it. UK papers mentioned it, but buried 
in other stories, at least so far. Kind of interesting take on how the media 
decides to weigh things. 
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #36 of 411: petite, demure, and happy to flip you the bird (izzie) Fri 31 Jan 03 17:51
    

it was mentioned on CNN at supper time here.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #37 of 411: do not refer to recently deceased persons as being "paws up" (dsg) Fri 31 Jan 03 17:58
    

What Blix is doing is merely stating and interpreting his findings.  It's
neither his place (nor, I'm sure, his desire) to make the political
calculations and decisions on what action to take (or not to take) next.
"Cheating" and "deceiving" and even "cooperating" have wildly different
meanings at 1600 Penn. Ave., NW.  All Bush wants is an excuse, any excuse.
I'm sure Blix wants to scream "Hey, that's NOT what I said or even meant!",
but it's all out of his hands now.  The train's left the station.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #38 of 411: Chuck Charlton (chuck) Sat 1 Feb 03 17:38
    
I was looking at the news about Columbia at salon.com, and the
lead article is from the AP.  It contains the statement, "In 42
years of U.S. human space flight, there had never been an
accident during the descent to Earth or landing."

Not so.  Gordon Cooper experienced a major malfunction of the
automatic control system during re-entry on Mercury 9.  But he 
survived.

http://www.nasm.si.edu/nasm/nass/pevents/cooper.htm
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #39 of 411: Pete Hanson (wolfy) Sat 1 Feb 03 18:09
    
A major malfunction and an accident aren't quite the same thing.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #40 of 411: Chuck Charlton (chuck) Sat 1 Feb 03 18:14
    
Well, true.  Gordo lived to brag about it.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #41 of 411: Growlin Jack King (gjk) Sat 1 Feb 03 19:38
    

And (no source to cite) Virgil "Gus" Grissom's capsule had a failure of one
of the three flotation collars, ironically submerging his teeny window,
making him think he was sinking.  So the saltwater blew the hatch (his
story) or he blew the hatch himself (as any Navy pilot would if he thought
his airship was sinking).

That could count as a reentry problem.

And what about John Glenn?

Mission Control told him to keep his retrorocket assembly attached to hold
his heat shield in place.  That was the first American in orbit and a
fucking drop-deap-serious reentry problem.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #42 of 411: do not refer to recently deceased persons as being "paws up" (dsg) Sat 1 Feb 03 19:38
    

I know the Soviets lost at least one craft when it crash-landed early in
their manned spaceflight program.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #43 of 411: Pete Hanson (wolfy) Sun 2 Feb 03 07:14
    
I don't remember that one, but there was a soviet craft that, IIRC, lost
cabin pressure during re-entry, killing all 3 cosmonauts.  This would have
been around 1970 or 71 I think.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #44 of 411: Angie Coiro (coiro) Sun 2 Feb 03 10:50
    
NASA spouse confirms that, wolfy. He's not exactly sure of the year
either.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #45 of 411: petite, demure, and happy to flip you the bird (izzie) Tue 4 Feb 03 19:33
    

For my son's homeschooling, we subscribe to an e-newsletter from NASA.  I
thought that tonight's newsletter was really a perfect tribute to the lost
shuttle crew.  What follows is it's entirety.


Feb. 4th, 2003: At the dawn of the space age some 40 years ago, we always
knew who was orbiting Earth or flying to the Moon. Neil Armstrong, Yuri
Gagarin, John Glenn. They were household names--everywhere.

Lately it's different. Space flight has become more "routine." Another
flight of the shuttle. Another visit to the space station. Who's onboard
this time? Unless you're a NASA employee or a serious space enthusiast,
you might not know.

Dave Brown, Rick Husband, Laurel Clark, Kalpana Chawla, Michael Anderson,
William McCool, and Ilan Ramon

Now we know. Those are the names of the seven astronauts who were
tragically lost on Saturday, Feb. 1st, when the space shuttle Columbia
(STS-107) broke apart over Texas.

Before the accident, perhaps, they were strangers to you. But if that's
so, why did you have a knot in your gut when you heard the news? What were
those tears all about? Why do you feel so deep-down sad for seven
strangers?

Astronauts have an unaccountable hold on us. They are explorers. Curious,
humorous, serious, daring, careful. Where they go, they go in peace. Every
kid wants to be one. Astronauts are the essence of humanity.

They are not strangers. They are us.

While still in orbit Dave Brown asked, jokingly, "do we really have to
come back?"

No. But we wish you had.

The Science@NASA team, as does all of NASA and the world, extends
heartfelt sympathies to the family, friends and colleagues of the STS-107
crew. Please see the NASA Home Page (http://www.nasa.gov) for more
information on the Columbia Investigation.

--Tony Phillips, Ron Koczor, Bryan Walls, Becky Bray, Patrick Meyer.

You are currently subscribed to snglist as: izzie@well.com

This is a free service.

To UNSUBSCRIBE, or CHANGE your address on this service, go to
//science.nasa.gov/news/subscribe.asp?e=izzie@well.com" class="hft-urls">http://science.nasa.gov/news/subscribe.asp?e=izzie@well.com
or send a blank email to leave-snglist-904954O@snglist.msfc.nasa.gov.

NASA is looking for Teachers to be Astronauts! Are you
the right person, or do you know someone who might be?
Check out http://edspace.nasa.gov/?science.nasa.gov for information.

If you need to get in touch with us directly, please go to
http://science.nasa.gov/comments

Home page: http://science.nasa.gov
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #46 of 411: pretty much the whole menu was spittable (wellelp) Tue 4 Feb 03 21:47
    
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #47 of 411: ... (maya) Wed 5 Feb 03 00:01
    
I found this quote of Thucydides (460-400 B.C.):  "But the bravest are
surely those who have the clearest vision of what is before them,
glory and danger alike, and yet notwithstanding go out to meet it."

As succinct as it is spot on.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #48 of 411: Hal Royaltey (hal) Wed 5 Feb 03 12:23
    
OK ... Powell has stated his case.  Did he change your mind?
Help you decide?   His speech as half over before I was up 
this AM, so I'm gonna go read it online.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #49 of 411: interesting times (jmcarlin) Wed 5 Feb 03 12:41
    

I heard part but not all of the speach. What I heard reinforced my belief
that Saddam is no saint. But it did not budge my belief that attacking
Iraq now is a bad idea.
  
pre.vue.22 : Politics and Current Events
permalink #50 of 411: tambourine verde (barb-albq) Wed 5 Feb 03 12:49
    
Besides Britain, the others on the Security Council are now saying the
same thing. Step up the inspections and give them time seems to be the
conclusion.
  

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